Talk:Shah Suwar

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Shah Suwar/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Aintabli (talk · contribs) 03:14, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Amir Ghandi (talk · contribs) 07:27, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hello! I'll be reviewing this article! Amir Ghandi (talk) 07:27, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

First suggestion, consider breaking the lead into two parts from "Shah Suwar started loosening his ties with the Ottomans". Amir Ghandi (talk) 07:30, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Done

• Rephrase "Qaitbay further used Shah Suwar's rocky relations with the Ottomans to his gain by seeding mistrust among Turkmen lords loyal to Shah Suwar and asking them to instead assist the Mamluks." to something more concise and summarized

  Tried to make it more concise. How does it look?

‌ Looks great!

• "He and many of his brothers were brought to Cairo on 24 August 1472, where a major celebration took place. Shah Suwar was hanged at Bab Zuweila. He was replaced by Shah Budak as the new ruler." to "He and many of his brothers were brought to Cairo on 24 August 1472, where he was executed. He was succeeded by his brother, Shah Budak." Bab Zuweila is too specific to be mentioned at the lead, as it is a gate not a significant town or city.

   Done Aintabli (talk) 17:44, 7 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Background

• Is there any pictures we can use? A map perhaps? The article as a whole suffers from a dearth of images, so anything would be appreciated

  I think there are no well-sourced maps to add to the article. I will add a location map including the major towns that were mentioned. On a different note, there are images of his coin(s) circulating on the Internet, which I really want to upload to Wikipedia, but licensing remains obscure. Aintabli (talk) 01:49, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  I have now added a simple location map.

• "arranging marriages between their daughters and the sons of the Ottoman sultans." This is somewhat of an awkward sentence to me, consider changing it to "Marrying into the royal Ottoman family" or something like that

   Done

• You should clear that Malik Arselan is Suleiman's son

   Done

Early life and rise to power

• Is there no information about his adolescent or childhood? If not, then consider deleting the Early life part of the name

  Removed "Early life" from the section title.

• Something I didn't mention earlier, the Dulkadir in the template should be linked

   Done

• Can you add the English equivalent of takirname as a note (template:EFN) or in ()s?

   Done

• "Shah Budak called for Mamluk aid against his Ottoman-backed brother. The Mamluk Sultan Khushqadam thus sent Berdi Beg, the governor of Aleppo, to support Shah Budak in the conflict." To "Shah Budak requested Mamluk aid, and the Mamluk Sultan Khushqadam sent Berdi Beg, the governor of Aleppo, to help him"

   Done

• "Shah Suwar was further given Dulkadir and Bozok nomads under his authority" To "Shah Suwar gained more cotrol of the Dulkadir and Bozok nomads"

  He didn't exactly gain control by himself. The Ottomans recognized/granted his authority over the nomads. Changed to Shah Suwar was officially granted authority over the Dulkadir and Bozok nomads.

War with Khusqadam

• "Shortly after Shah Suwar's rise to power, the Mamluk Sultan Khushqadam championed Shah Suwar's uncle Rustam Beg and assigned Yashbak al-Bajasi, the governor of Aleppo, to help Rustam gain the throne" change the word championed to supported or started supporting

   Done

• "had previously fiercely refused to recognize Shah Suwar" is redundant

  Removed.

• "Shah Suwar's claimant uncle" Is also redundant

  Removed.

• "Eyeing the right moment to flank" to "Waiting for the right moment to flank"

   Done

• "who claimed his responsibility for the defeat" to "Who claimed him responsible for the defeat"

   Done

War with Qaitbay

• "Around this time" State the year.

   Done

• ‌ "former rival uncle Rustam Beg" uncle should be deleted

   Done

• "consulted the Caliph" can you link it to the contemporary caliph at the time?

   Done

• "Malik al-Muzaffar" add double primes

  Added {{transl|ar}}.

• "that were found in Aleppo" add brackets

   Done

• Fourth Mamluk campaign; broke this section's sentence into two parts.

  @Amir Ghandi: Not sure which sentence, because I can't see any part to split in the first two-three sentences of that section unlike in the next section.

  Split from "However, the next month"

  Started a new paragraph. I think that's what you wanted me to do. Aintabli (talk) 23:30, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

• Fifth Mamluk campaign; ditto

  Split the first sentence. Aintabli (talk) 18:15, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  Are you sure? I don't any difference right now. Amir Ghandi (talk) 20:40, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  @Amir Ghandi, before: According to Ottoman historians such as Aşıkpaşazade, Solakzade, and Hoja Sa'd al-Din, Qaitbay sent many gifts to Mehmed II urging him to stop safeguarding Shah Suwar and suggested that he would leave Egypt to the Ottomans if Mehmed II let him take vengeance on Shah Suwar.

  After: According to Ottoman historians such as Aşıkpaşazade, Solakzade, and Hoja Sa'd al-Din, Qaitbay sent many gifts to Mehmed II urging him to stop safeguarding Shah Suwar. Qaitbay suggested that he would leave Egypt to the Ottomans if Mehmed II let him take vengeance on Shah Suwar. Aintabli (talk) 23:26, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  Oh, I meant a new paragraph. Sorry, my bad. Amir Ghandi (talk) 23:34, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Surrender and execution

• "Moreover, Mehmed II's son Bayezid offered to supply the Mamluk army's needs" Remove "moreover"

  Removed.

• "Shah Suwar thus fell into despair and requested Qaitbay's brother Timraz, from the Mamluk retinue, to pass on his invitation for Yashbak to come to the castle for his surrender" to "Shah Suwar became hopeless and asked Yashbak to enter his castle, where Shah Suwar would surrender to him"

  Replaced almost verbatim but moved "hopeless" to the beginning of the sentence, so that it reads "Hopeless, Shah Suwar asked Yashbak..."

• "that Timraz and other Mamluk commanders are taken as hostage" here add that Timraz is Qaitbay's brother and that he is present in the retinue

  Added.

• Add English equivalent for qadi

  Added

• "Turkmen lords loyal to Shah Suwar were not hanged but chopped up into pieces" delete "were not hanged but"

  Removed.

• "Shah Suwar was in his forties when he died" to "At the time of death, Shah Suwar was in his 40s"

  Replaced.

Coinage

• Nothing to add here

Family

• "would be killed by Ferhat Pasha" to "was killed by Ferhat Pasha"

   Done

• "which concluded the history of the Dulkadirids, the lands of whom were annexed by the Ottoman Empire" new sentence "Afterwards, the lands of the Dulkadirids were annexed by the Ottoman Empire"

   Done Aintabli (talk) 23:24, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bibliography

• Sources are reliable, nothing to add here

Okay, that was all my concerns. Passing it now. Congratulations! Amir Ghandi (talk) 23:42, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by AirshipJungleman29 talk 01:02, 9 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

• ... that a major parade took place in Cairo on 24 August 1472 for the hanging of Shah Suwar (r. 1466–72), the ninth ruler of Dulkadir, who clashed with the Mamluk Egypt throughout the entirety of his reign? Source: Yinanç, Refet (1989). Dulkadir Beyliği (in Turkish). Ankara: Turkish Historical Society Press. pp. 74–76. ISBN 9751601711. OCLC 21676736.
  • Reviewed:

Improved to Good Article status by Aintabli (talk).

Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has less than 5 past nominations.

Post-promotion hook changes will be logged on the talk page; consider watching the nomination until the hook appears on the Main Page.

Aintabli (talk) 03:45, 25 April 2024 (UTC).[reply]

• You can't have parentheses in the hook per WP:DYK200, and I'd expect a more merciless reviewer to truncate the hook at "Suwar".--Launchballer 07:37, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  @Launchballer: I don't mind changing the hook to:

Alt1 ...that a major parade took place in Cairo on 24 August 1472 for the hanging of Shah Suwar?

or something similar. Aintabli (talk) 14:16, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fine by me. Full review needed.--Launchballer 14:19, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

General eligibility:

• New enough:
• Long enough:
• Other problems:

Policy compliance:

• Adequate sourcing:
• Neutral:
• Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:
• Other problems:

Overall: A lot of this is taken on faith because this is a GA and because of the way it's sourced. Too bad there is no photo. Alt 1 is the prferred hook. --evrik ^(talk) 17:37, 8 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]